Posted by Someone Else at 9:22pm Aug 29 '11I can all but promise you it's mostly pot. And I don't say that because pot is the most used or because people on welfare love their bud or suchlike, I say that because drug tests are (by coincidence) very fucking hard on pot smokers, thanks to the way drugs metabolize.
What you ask in question 1 is a vital question...not about faking the test, but this part: Also I'm unsure of how reliable the test are: if I were to stay sober for a week before getting the test done, and then immediately resume my habit (now funded in part by the state of Florida!) afterward, would the test show that?
You see, most drugs metabolize in days. Pot doesn't. Someone who smokes maybe a couple times a week will test hot for up to 3-4 weeks after ceasing. Someone who smokes daily or multiple times a day may piss hot for months afterwards.
Now, I will make an allowance that stopping pot for a few days isn't impossible even for the most dependent people, especially if they can foresee getting it back after those few days. Stopping meth or cocaine for a few days? Not so easy. But the point still stands that if someone wants to use the hard drugs, all they have to do is stop for at most about a week before pissing and they'll most likely test clean.
I don't think it's by design that drug tests discriminate against pot smokers, I think it's just a coincidence, but it still stands that pot smokers are always the worst off when it comes to drug users having to pass a drug test.
Incidentally, the only benefit affected by Florida's new regulation is a $300/month cash benefit provided by the state. Federal welfare, food stamps, etc, are unaffected. It's also a capped lifetime benefit, I think you can't be on it for more than 3 total years in your life (that number might be 2 or 4, can't recall for sure, but point being it's a capped lifetime benefit meant to get people through hard times, not carry them through life). Now, to Joe Potsmoker, that may be the difference between paying his rent and being out on the streets. Maybe Joe Potsmoker didn't have time to clean out his system before the regulation went into effect. And now Joe Potsmoker has no way to make ends meet, no way to cover his rent. Do you think this in any way leads Joe Potsmoker to a better life? Think he'll be inspired to quit the bud and go get a better job (which he probably can't get in this economy anyway)? I think it's more likely (though hardly a definite truth, obviously) that Joe Potsmoker will be depressed and may even try something else to help numb the pain, feeling pretty thoroughly at rock bottom after losing what little he had. And while I don't subscribe to the bullshit about pot being a gateway drug, having the connections to get pot usually means you're capable of getting other drugs too.
Also, just want to point this out. From the article you linked:
"The taxpayers deserve to know that the money they are spending is being used for its intended purpose," he said. "In this case, with [temporary cash assistance], the purpose is to help families become independent and self-sufficient. If a family receiving [cash assistance] includes someone who has a substance abuse problem, the odds of that money being used for purposes other than helping that family increases."
How much of that welfare money goes to legal drugs--like the highly addictive and socially acceptable poison we love to ingest recreationally, known as alcohol, or the also highly addictive tobacco that has a habit of killing its consumers. And while we're on that, there are a whole slew of legal highs as well, things like salvia (though more and more states are introducing legislation against that one, too).
I think it's great to make sure government money doesn't go to supporting drug habits (including alcohol and tobacco!!), or other unhealthy habits (I'm all for not letting people get soda on food stamps, for instance). I think it will require a full out overhaul of the welfare system though, not just saying "you use drugs, therefore you're not worthy of help."
What you ask in question 1 is a vital question...not about faking the test, but this part: Also I'm unsure of how reliable the test are: if I were to stay sober for a week before getting the test done, and then immediately resume my habit (now funded in part by the state of Florida!) afterward, would the test show that?
You see, most drugs metabolize in days. Pot doesn't. Someone who smokes maybe a couple times a week will test hot for up to 3-4 weeks after ceasing. Someone who smokes daily or multiple times a day may piss hot for months afterwards.
Now, I will make an allowance that stopping pot for a few days isn't impossible even for the most dependent people, especially if they can foresee getting it back after those few days. Stopping meth or cocaine for a few days? Not so easy. But the point still stands that if someone wants to use the hard drugs, all they have to do is stop for at most about a week before pissing and they'll most likely test clean.
I don't think it's by design that drug tests discriminate against pot smokers, I think it's just a coincidence, but it still stands that pot smokers are always the worst off when it comes to drug users having to pass a drug test.
Incidentally, the only benefit affected by Florida's new regulation is a $300/month cash benefit provided by the state. Federal welfare, food stamps, etc, are unaffected. It's also a capped lifetime benefit, I think you can't be on it for more than 3 total years in your life (that number might be 2 or 4, can't recall for sure, but point being it's a capped lifetime benefit meant to get people through hard times, not carry them through life). Now, to Joe Potsmoker, that may be the difference between paying his rent and being out on the streets. Maybe Joe Potsmoker didn't have time to clean out his system before the regulation went into effect. And now Joe Potsmoker has no way to make ends meet, no way to cover his rent. Do you think this in any way leads Joe Potsmoker to a better life? Think he'll be inspired to quit the bud and go get a better job (which he probably can't get in this economy anyway)? I think it's more likely (though hardly a definite truth, obviously) that Joe Potsmoker will be depressed and may even try something else to help numb the pain, feeling pretty thoroughly at rock bottom after losing what little he had. And while I don't subscribe to the bullshit about pot being a gateway drug, having the connections to get pot usually means you're capable of getting other drugs too.
Also, just want to point this out. From the article you linked:
"The taxpayers deserve to know that the money they are spending is being used for its intended purpose," he said. "In this case, with [temporary cash assistance], the purpose is to help families become independent and self-sufficient. If a family receiving [cash assistance] includes someone who has a substance abuse problem, the odds of that money being used for purposes other than helping that family increases."
How much of that welfare money goes to legal drugs--like the highly addictive and socially acceptable poison we love to ingest recreationally, known as alcohol, or the also highly addictive tobacco that has a habit of killing its consumers. And while we're on that, there are a whole slew of legal highs as well, things like salvia (though more and more states are introducing legislation against that one, too).
I think it's great to make sure government money doesn't go to supporting drug habits (including alcohol and tobacco!!), or other unhealthy habits (I'm all for not letting people get soda on food stamps, for instance). I think it will require a full out overhaul of the welfare system though, not just saying "you use drugs, therefore you're not worthy of help."
I'm more curious *which* drugs people failed for - Someone Else