Posted by Otter at 10:28am Aug 4 '09Has anyone heard about this recent "controversy"? I just began reading about it today. This is close to my heart for a number of reasons. There is some new concern about the swine flu vaccine containing a new adjuvant which may be more dangerous than earlier vaccine adjuvants. Specifically there is talk about the adjuvant Squalene being a causative factor in auto-immune disorders.
My wife, kids, and I have always had flu vaccines for at least the last 9-10 years. Even the year when it was "scarce" we managed to get one because we were in the "caregiver" class volunteering at my wife's grandmother's nursing home.
I have never once felt like there was an unreasonable side-effect associated with the shot with the exception only of minor muscle soreness in the injection area (totally expected).
Earlier Vaccines contained adjuvants from Aluminum derivatives (also poisonous) and Mercury derivatives. I did quite a bit of research on this when my first son was diagnosed as a high functioning Autistic. There is still a whole society of people who believe Autism is to blame on these earlier vaccine adjuvants as well as other vaccines. I personally have decided that there is no statistically reliable connection.
There is also a whole growing "cottage" industry of companies trying to push FEAR about vaccines out into the American Public so they can sell more supplements instead. The question always arrives at, who is telling the truth, and who is propagandizing? Or is the truth somewhere in between?
So that brings me to my latest concern... and a question for any other 4k members who are smarter about these things than I am.
Is a vaccine against the swine flu worth the risk of a Squalene-containing injection?
Squalene - http://en.wikipedia.org/[private]/Squalene
Primarily comes from Shark Liver Oil - has been consumed orally as a supplement for a long time. Can also be derived from plants. We all know that oral ingestion of a substance vs. subcutaneous injection though produces quite different results... see insulin therapy for advanced diabetes for example. You cannot take insulin by mouth, it will not work.
If you don't know what role the "Adjuvant" plays:
Immunologic adjuvant: http://en.wikipedia.org/[private]/Immunologic_adjuvant
As you can see, it's a critical role to any vaccine process.
Now here's the "scare" part.... was Squalene when used in an experimental Anthrax vaccine really linked to Gulf War Syndrome?
http://en.wikipedia.org/[private]/Gulf_War_syndrome
http://ajp.amjpathol.org/cgi/content/abstract/156/6/2057
http://www.autoimmune.com/GWSGen.html
Consider that the last link from "autoimmune.com" may be a company that benefits financially from convincing people to NOT take the current swine flu vaccine. I was actually not able to find a story on this that suggests a direct link that wasn't funded by a commercial organization.
So what do I do?
Risk A: Take the vaccine and hope for the best
Risk B: Don't take the vaccine and hope to not get sick - be clean as always... if you do get sick realize that it's just a "bad flu" and chances of survival without lasting effect are extremely good anyway.
Reasons why this is close to my heart:
My wife has Rheumatoid Arthritis - an autoimmune disorder. This is a medically-proven genetically linked throughout her family's lineage.
My older son has mild high-functioning Autism... which some people believe may be an autoimmune disorder caused by vaccines.
My younger son has Type 1 diabetes which is absolutely an autoimmune disorder. This could be genetically linked throughout my wife's family but it is not medically proven that this is possible. None-the-less, her family seems to have a history of "every other generation" either Type 1 Diabetes or Rheumatoid Arthritis.
I do not have any autoimmune disorders that I'm aware-of.
So yes, it's close to me because of my EXPERIENCE with my own loved-ones. However all these chronic diseases in OUR family do not seem linkable to vaccines at all.... but it definitely raises a flag of concern to me whenever I hear "possible cause of autoimmune diseases".
So what do you guys think?
I'm going to talk it over with my wife... I think we may actually skip the flu vaccine entirely this year and just wait to see what happens.... but she may cause me to decide otherwise after further discussion.
My wife, kids, and I have always had flu vaccines for at least the last 9-10 years. Even the year when it was "scarce" we managed to get one because we were in the "caregiver" class volunteering at my wife's grandmother's nursing home.
I have never once felt like there was an unreasonable side-effect associated with the shot with the exception only of minor muscle soreness in the injection area (totally expected).
Earlier Vaccines contained adjuvants from Aluminum derivatives (also poisonous) and Mercury derivatives. I did quite a bit of research on this when my first son was diagnosed as a high functioning Autistic. There is still a whole society of people who believe Autism is to blame on these earlier vaccine adjuvants as well as other vaccines. I personally have decided that there is no statistically reliable connection.
There is also a whole growing "cottage" industry of companies trying to push FEAR about vaccines out into the American Public so they can sell more supplements instead. The question always arrives at, who is telling the truth, and who is propagandizing? Or is the truth somewhere in between?
So that brings me to my latest concern... and a question for any other 4k members who are smarter about these things than I am.
Is a vaccine against the swine flu worth the risk of a Squalene-containing injection?
Squalene - http://en.wikipedia.org/[private]/Squalene
Primarily comes from Shark Liver Oil - has been consumed orally as a supplement for a long time. Can also be derived from plants. We all know that oral ingestion of a substance vs. subcutaneous injection though produces quite different results... see insulin therapy for advanced diabetes for example. You cannot take insulin by mouth, it will not work.
If you don't know what role the "Adjuvant" plays:
Immunologic adjuvant: http://en.wikipedia.org/[private]/Immunologic_adjuvant
As you can see, it's a critical role to any vaccine process.
Now here's the "scare" part.... was Squalene when used in an experimental Anthrax vaccine really linked to Gulf War Syndrome?
http://en.wikipedia.org/[private]/Gulf_War_syndrome
http://ajp.amjpathol.org/cgi/content/abstract/156/6/2057
http://www.autoimmune.com/GWSGen.html
Consider that the last link from "autoimmune.com" may be a company that benefits financially from convincing people to NOT take the current swine flu vaccine. I was actually not able to find a story on this that suggests a direct link that wasn't funded by a commercial organization.
So what do I do?
Risk A: Take the vaccine and hope for the best
Risk B: Don't take the vaccine and hope to not get sick - be clean as always... if you do get sick realize that it's just a "bad flu" and chances of survival without lasting effect are extremely good anyway.
Reasons why this is close to my heart:
My wife has Rheumatoid Arthritis - an autoimmune disorder. This is a medically-proven genetically linked throughout her family's lineage.
My older son has mild high-functioning Autism... which some people believe may be an autoimmune disorder caused by vaccines.
My younger son has Type 1 diabetes which is absolutely an autoimmune disorder. This could be genetically linked throughout my wife's family but it is not medically proven that this is possible. None-the-less, her family seems to have a history of "every other generation" either Type 1 Diabetes or Rheumatoid Arthritis.
I do not have any autoimmune disorders that I'm aware-of.
So yes, it's close to me because of my EXPERIENCE with my own loved-ones. However all these chronic diseases in OUR family do not seem linkable to vaccines at all.... but it definitely raises a flag of concern to me whenever I hear "possible cause of autoimmune diseases".
So what do you guys think?
I'm going to talk it over with my wife... I think we may actually skip the flu vaccine entirely this year and just wait to see what happens.... but she may cause me to decide otherwise after further discussion.
added on 10:29am Aug 4 '09:
Also - Four - if you'd like to move this to a public forum and make it public I'm ok with that.
H1N1 "Swine Flu" Vaccine worth the risk? - Otter